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Darka

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PostSubject: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 09, 2010 3:43 am

We can hype the game up as high as we want but how the game actually turns out is often far from what many assumed.
Have an expectation for the game?

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Kai-Sun
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 09, 2010 4:38 pm

Darka wrote:
We can hype the game up as high as we want but how the game actually turns out is often far from what many assumed.
Have an expectation for the game?


I have a bunch of expectations, but with that said I'm rather laid back. As long as things aren't too broken balance wise, everything I've seen so far leads me to believe the game will great. I'm really looking foward to being able to do many different things with my guildies and everyone else in the community, so I guess I'm expecting a good bit of content at launch, or a good plan to release a steady floor of well developed content. Hopefully it's varied an allows a good bit of flexibility so that people can find things they like and share them with everyone else, and avoid the "elitism" plague many games tend to foster.
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 09, 2010 11:29 pm

Darka wrote:
We can hype the game up as high as we want but how the game actually turns out is often far from what many assumed.
Have an expectation for the game?


I have gone into this as a bit of a realist. (Though I am a dreamer too no question hence trying to start this up, hehe) I don't know what I was expecting when this was first announced? It did not jump out at me right away, As much as I liked BioWare games, I think in general I had just become a little jaded with MMOs.

Then I saw the 'Cinematic Trailer'..............Near wet myself, and been looking forward to this game ever since, lol. Smile

Though I know the game won't look as stunning as the trailer sadly, I know it will look and feel quite similar to KOTOR, and I loved that game too, so thats fine with me. (just the saber hilt size is a little...../shudder, lol)

I don't really know what to expect from this as an MMO experience, mostly because so far we have seen little if any MMO features to this game as yet. Right now all I am really looking at presently what we have seen, we know the story will be awesome, I expect the combat to be pretty decent, though sadly not TPS or FPS, but I think thats still a leap too far for an MMO just yet, still one day.......one day.....lol.

I guess mostly, I am just waiting to see what happens, space was a let down for me, crafting could be neat, but I need more info on it I guess, and I think that is also where we are with the rest of the game too, we are just waiting to find out.

I am optomistic, I think this game is in good hands, and regardless of anything I will play this for the story, and enjoy the combat side to things, but if this is to be a long term venture, and a long term success? that we will find out over the next few months I guess, when we actually find out more about the MMO and community sides of the game. Smile

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MorgonKara
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 10, 2010 6:01 pm

Darka wrote:
We can hype the game up as high as we want but how the game actually turns out is often far from what many assumed.
Have an expectation for the game?

Yes I have a lot of expectations for TOR.

-I expect a lot of players will overlook the multiplayer aspects of the game for the bits that are solo-able, which may turn out to be unfortunate because I believe that multi-player will actually be one of the strongest aspects of SWTOR. (Especially for the voiced dialogs, but also for general combat and questing). You see a lot of negative chatter about how SWTOR is a "single-player MMO" but I don't think that is true at all. At least it won't be unless the players decide to solo all the time.
I'm sure many of you have experienced it, most players seem to solo MMOs as much as possible and only group if they have to or if it's convenient (like getting credit for a spawn kill). Sometimes I wonder where all these "militant, pro-multiplayer" forums people are when I'm actually playing an MMO. Probably soloing.

-I expect the combat gameplay to be yet another strong aspect of TOR. While I don't expect it to be particularly difficult (for the most part), the design they are using is meant to keep the player engaged. Watch the gameplay videos, You are often outnumbered 3 to 1 and there is no auto-attack, which means you can't sit back and let the game grind for you. The animations and combat effects are also visually interesting, especially when compared to other MMOs.

-I expect the classes to play very differently. I think that making multiple characters will be a great part of SWTOR for those interested in doing that and that the game will offer a great deal in terms of re-playability. That is something I am particularly excited about because I find many games to be lacking in terms of interesting player classes.

-Story. I expect story and who doesn't. It's become a bit of a joke at this point because the 4th pillar has been harped on more than anything, but what do you expect? It's a Bioware game and one thing they do know is how to deliver a story. I expect each class to have an epic story that takes you through the game. I also expect each faction to have an epic story. Your character has a story, your companions have a story, your blaster has a story. It's what makes their games cool.


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Gamewiz

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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 10, 2010 6:22 pm

I try to not have a lot of expectations regarding games... Because with high expectations comes the higher risk of regret. Take for instance lots of people and the Space Combat announcement. Wink

Based upon what I've seen and heard, I'm stoked about TOR. I know that this game is going to be great because it's Star Wars, and it's Bioware. Bioware is approaching this game the same way WoW did back when it was in development... You take all the best MMOs of it's time, combine them, and improve upon them. Don't reinvent the wheel. Don't innovate to where you cater more to a niche group of people. Bioware is taking things from WoW, WAR, EvE, and all the other MMOs, plus incorporating the renowned "Bioware storytelling" and making a game that is turning out to be my dream game. Smile

I pray that TOR doesn't get pushed back because I need to play this game badly. Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 10, 2010 6:55 pm

Gamewiz wrote:
I try to not have a lot of expectations regarding games... Because with high expectations comes the higher risk of regret. Take for instance lots of people and the Space Combat announcement. Wink

Based upon what I've seen and heard, I'm stoked about TOR. I know that this game is going to be great because it's Star Wars, and it's Bioware. Bioware is approaching this game the same way WoW did back when it was in development... You take all the best MMOs of it's time, combine them, and improve upon them. Don't reinvent the wheel. Don't innovate to where you cater more to a niche group of people. Bioware is taking things from WoW, WAR, EvE, and all the other MMOs, plus incorporating the renowned "Bioware storytelling" and making a game that is turning out to be my dream game. Smile

I pray that TOR doesn't get pushed back because I need to play this game badly. Very Happy

Come again? "I try not to have a lot of expectations" Yeah, well you fail big time! lol! meesa like
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Gamewiz

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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 10, 2010 7:12 pm

Selven wrote:
Gamewiz wrote:
I try to not have a lot of expectations regarding games... Because with high expectations comes the higher risk of regret. Take for instance lots of people and the Space Combat announcement. Wink

Based upon what I've seen and heard, I'm stoked about TOR. I know that this game is going to be great because it's Star Wars, and it's Bioware. Bioware is approaching this game the same way WoW did back when it was in development... You take all the best MMOs of it's time, combine them, and improve upon them. Don't reinvent the wheel. Don't innovate to where you cater more to a niche group of people. Bioware is taking things from WoW, WAR, EvE, and all the other MMOs, plus incorporating the renowned "Bioware storytelling" and making a game that is turning out to be my dream game. Smile

I pray that TOR doesn't get pushed back because I need to play this game badly. Very Happy

Come again? "I try not to have a lot of expectations" Yeah, well you fail big time! lol! meesa like

Lol... not really. When I say Bioware is taking things from other MMOs... that's not an expectation, that's an observation of what I'm seeing. Bioware making a game that is turning out to be my dream game isn't the same as me EXPECTING it to be my dream game. Wink Do I think it will be? I don't know, I haven't played it yet. Do I think it's turning out like that? Based upon everything we've seen, it has so far!

When I said I know this game is going to be great, yes, that was an expectation. Smile Guilty as charged!

I guess when I say that I don't hold alot of expectations, it's more about certain game features, how things will be implemented, etc... For instance, I don't have expectations regarding raiding because I don't want to think it'll go one way, and Bioware announces something completely different and I get disappointed. I'd rather wait and see what they announce, THEN formulate my opinion on raiding based upon the information given.
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azarhal

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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 10, 2010 11:17 pm

I'm optimistic, although I expect a big clash of "ideals" when the game get released, mostly because BioWare don't release a lot of information about their games before release and because way to many people see TOR as their next messiah...

Me, I just hope it's a fun game to play, that the Star Wars immersion is in, that the community is fun to play with and that players participate in the game world.

Fun game and Star Wars immersion, I'm not scared about these: KoTOR show what BioWare is capable of and LucasArts is working on everything sound related. Despite having different teams working on different games, all BioWare games are unified in term of how they feel to me, so TOR being made by a different studio doesn't "scare" me.

Un-fun community would be sad, but there is still workarounds (friends, soloing, etc). I actually left the official forums for 4 months after E3 3010, because of the "fauna".

Participate is the hard one. That game shouldn't create players who only care about their next piece of loot. Players should care about the game world too. Doesn't mean role-playing, but it should mean "living" in the world: joining events, helping people, etc.

It's like lots of people expect to be paid (loot) to play a MMO and everything that doesn't have a paycheck (loot) associated is ignored. I expect to see a lot of these people in SWTOR...



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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 10, 2010 11:25 pm

Gamewiz wrote:


Lol... not really. When I say Bioware is taking things from other MMOs... that's not an expectation, that's an observation of what I'm seeing. Bioware making a game that is turning out to be my dream game isn't the same as me EXPECTING it to be my dream game. Wink Do I think it will be? I don't know, I haven't played it yet. Do I think it's turning out like that? Based upon everything we've seen, it has so far!

When I said I know this game is going to be great, yes, that was an expectation. Smile Guilty as charged!

I guess when I say that I don't hold alot of expectations, it's more about certain game features, how things will be implemented, etc... For instance, I don't have expectations regarding raiding because I don't want to think it'll go one way, and Bioware announces something completely different and I get disappointed. I'd rather wait and see what they announce, THEN formulate my opinion on raiding based upon the information given.

Hehe, I know. I just couldn't resist Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 11, 2010 4:06 am

I know a lot of people have some high expectations for TOR. They expect a WoW killer or the best MMORPG ever.

I tend to me more realistic. My Expectations are pretty simple, if it's fun and it offers enough for a long haul of gaming I'll be happy. WoW kept my attention for the better part of 6 years so those expectations are pretty low I guess lol!
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 11, 2010 4:21 am

Havenae wrote:
I know a lot of people have some high expectations for TOR. They expect a WoW killer or the best MMORPG ever.

I tend to me more realistic. My Expectations are pretty simple, if it's fun and it offers enough for a long haul of gaming I'll be happy. WoW kept my attention for the better part of 6 years so those expectations are pretty low I guess lol!

Honestly, when you look at WoW and take stock of everything that has gone into that game in terms of design, I think the idea of any game coming along and "killing" it isn't very likely. Moreover, I don't believe measuring a game should be done in extremes. Take City of Heroes for example; it could be described as the little MMO that could by the fact that it had a small dev team and slowly built a playerbase over the years and now it is one of NCSoft's major titles. Its far from making Blizzard nervious, but I don't believe the developers at Paragon Studios are worried for their jobs.

As for TOR (oh yeah, there's the topic Razz ), I think it has everything going for it: a proven developer, a proven IP, and a community looking to go the distance. Mistakes will inevitably be made, but I think all parties involved are willing to learn from their mistakes and make SWTOR something special.
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 11, 2010 9:53 am

Gamewiz wrote:
Lol... not really. When I say Bioware is taking things from other MMOs... that's not an expectation, that's an observation of what I'm seeing. Bioware making a game that is turning out to be my dream game isn't the same as me EXPECTING it to be my dream game. Wink Do I think it will be? I don't know, I haven't played it yet. Do I think it's turning out like that? Based upon everything we've seen, it has so far!

When I said I know this game is going to be great, yes, that was an expectation. Smile Guilty as charged!

I guess when I say that I don't hold alot of expectations, it's more about certain game features, how things will be implemented, etc... For instance, I don't have expectations regarding raiding because I don't want to think it'll go one way, and Bioware announces something completely different and I get disappointed. I'd rather wait and see what they announce, THEN formulate my opinion on raiding based upon the information given.

You put it very well! Thats about how I feel! I look at what they throw at me and then I see what I can do with it, if I can turn it into something fun. If, in the end, I have no fun I'll be disappointed and quit of course. But looking at what we got so far I am VERY sure I'll have alot of gaming fun coming my way flower
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 11, 2010 1:18 pm

Consensual pvp. I can deal with anything else, been waiting way too long for another SW mmo Razz
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 11, 2010 1:21 pm

I don't have any expectations yet, but i do have a lot of hopes. Some of them:

1. A huge, and i mean really HUGE world, waiting for me to explore it.

2. Good crafting system.

3. Optional pvp. I am not very good at it Embarassed

4. A lots of character customization options. Outfit, talents, etc.

Soloing vs grouping: i think it has to be balanced. Of course playing with friends is fun, but soloing helps you to learn how to play your char in the most efficient way. Especially if you face a tough opponent.
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 11, 2010 3:48 pm

Lednik wrote:
I don't have any expectations yet, but i do have a lot of hopes. Some of them:

1. A huge, and i mean really HUGE world, waiting for me to explore it.

I'm wondering about this one, myself. I don't know how many of you have actually seen the hero engines at work as far as development goes but, it allows multiple people to build worlds simultaneously and in real time. The engine they are using might not be the prettiest but in terms of development it's simply amazing. It seems like it allows a lot of work to get done in a very short amount of time.

When I watch that and then think about the videos I've seen of the development team talking about TOR and how big it is, after seeing the engine at work I just have to wonder how big exactly are we talking? Will one planet be as big as say as big as all of WoW or a similar game? Will a planet be as big as a continent in most games? I mean I'm very curious because I could easily see TOR being extremely huge. I could see a planet actually feeling like a planet.
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 11, 2010 4:34 pm

Havenae wrote:
Lednik wrote:
I don't have any expectations yet, but i do have a lot of hopes. Some of them:

1. A huge, and i mean really HUGE world, waiting for me to explore it.

I'm wondering about this one, myself. I don't know how many of you have actually seen the hero engines at work as far as development goes but, it allows multiple people to build worlds simultaneously and in real time. The engine they are using might not be the prettiest but in terms of development it's simply amazing. It seems like it allows a lot of work to get done in a very short amount of time.

When I watch that and then think about the videos I've seen of the development team talking about TOR and how big it is, after seeing the engine at work I just have to wonder how big exactly are we talking? Will one planet be as big as say as big as all of WoW or a similar game? Will a planet be as big as a continent in most games? I mean I'm very curious because I could easily see TOR being extremely huge. I could see a planet actually feeling like a planet.

Personally I doubt the will be very big in all honesty.

If say you look at SWG which did have huge open worlds, it leads to the problem of how to fill it?

We already know there will not be player housing, or cities, so there is really very little point to all that empty space.

I am expecting this game to be pretty linear if i am honest, maybe plenty of trails leading off somewhere with mobs and other irritants along the way to block your path, likely with shear cliffs or mountains either side which you cannot climb or absail down, it will likely all feature on this huge map, of which 80% of it will not even be navigatable.

Thats not to put this on a downer, I just cannot see the maps being all that huge (Navigatable terrain wise) anways
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 11, 2010 4:45 pm

The thing with the maps is that you want them to be large, but not too large, but definately not too small either.

The larger it is the more immersive it has the potential to be, but too large and it'll feel empty and a chore to travel. It needs size and believable filling. Perhaps have roads from city one to city two, but next to the roads have large explorable areas that may contain secrets.

I'm hoping it'll be about the size of World of Warcraft (or even bigger) for each planet. Although I won't have a problem with it if the planets are smaller and may increase in size as the game gets older.
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 11, 2010 5:13 pm

Ty-Odi wrote:

Personally I doubt the will be very big in all honesty.

If say you look at SWG which did have huge open worlds, it leads to the problem of how to fill it?

We already know there will not be player housing, or cities, so there is really very little point to all that empty space.

I am expecting this game to be pretty linear if i am honest, maybe plenty of trails leading off somewhere with mobs and other irritants along the way to block your path, likely with shear cliffs or mountains either side which you cannot climb or absail down, it will likely all feature on this huge map, of which 80% of it will not even be navigatable.

Thats not to put this on a downer, I just cannot see the maps being all that huge (Navigatable terrain wise) anways

I think you have it. With BioWare stating that story is the main motivator, and their notions that Han and Chewy didn't "hang out in space" leads me to believe it will be fairly linear at first. I think once they get some more time to add after launch we'll see the universe grow with larger spaces to roam and sightsee, but for now I think we'll be sticking to the script for the most part.
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 11, 2010 6:11 pm

I'll just put my hopes and fears down...

Hopes:

*Bio-ware focuses on the community, not just their strengths (story/gameplay)

*They balance the player classes, so they don't have to go in and NERF the bejesus out of proffessions I/E SWG circa 2003...

*They don't make the game a giant KOTAR, but a functioning MMORPG

*The classes compliment each other, not just be "Look at me, I have a PvP template!"

*They add quests/storylines that incorporate the usage of groups, not just solo the entire storyline.

*Apartments! (I know its a pipedream)

Fears:

*They won't listen to the communities needs, but those very few, VERY loud whiny players. (SOE SadSadSad..)

*They won't release it til fall 11'

*They won't diversify the player ships (just the class bases ones)

*They don't give each planet its due (reason to go there..)

*They stay linear, and not combine the "theme park", and "sandbox" into one great game



I think they will put out a great game. I just fear that the community/social network might get lost in the "story arc" slipstream.....I hope not...

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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 11, 2010 11:21 pm

Variable wrote:
I think you have it. With BioWare stating that story is the main motivator, and their notions that Han and Chewy didn't "hang out in space" leads me to believe it will be fairly linear at first. I think once they get some more time to add after launch we'll see the universe grow with larger spaces to roam and sightsee, but for now I think we'll be sticking to the script for the most part.

And I expect the planets to be larger than what people expect, mostly because BioWare did 10x to the size of everything (looks at those tiny "humans" beside the player's ships!) and some planets seems to have wide open areas (example: Tatooine). But I don't like to compare gameworld size, because it has more to do with design than metrics. Example, Guild Wars 1 have one of the largest gameworld if you use metrics, but the way the game is made make it seems really small to the players.

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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 12, 2010 2:07 am

Darka wrote:
We can hype the game up as high as we want but how the game actually turns out is often far from what many assumed.
Have an expectation for the game?

Mine are real high I miss old swg, and pray this has just a little of that feeling again xD TOR- Your  Expectations? 240514
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Kai-Sun
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 12, 2010 2:13 am

I have one new expectation.

To have an utterly awesome community at launch, almost as if there was a forum for people who were of like mind that wall wanted to land on the same server.

Crazy, I know.

And Odi, the blue in your name is super hard to read on the board background, if no one has said it before.
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PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 12, 2010 2:19 am

Ty-Odi wrote:
Havenae wrote:
Lednik wrote:
I don't have any expectations yet, but i do have a lot of hopes. Some of them:

1. A huge, and i mean really HUGE world, waiting for me to explore it.

I'm wondering about this one, myself. I don't know how many of you have actually seen the hero engines at work as far as development goes but, it allows multiple people to build worlds simultaneously and in real time. The engine they are using might not be the prettiest but in terms of development it's simply amazing. It seems like it allows a lot of work to get done in a very short amount of time.

When I watch that and then think about the videos I've seen of the development team talking about TOR and how big it is, after seeing the engine at work I just have to wonder how big exactly are we talking? Will one planet be as big as say as big as all of WoW or a similar game? Will a planet be as big as a continent in most games? I mean I'm very curious because I could easily see TOR being extremely huge. I could see a planet actually feeling like a planet.

Personally I doubt the will be very big in all honesty.

If say you look at SWG which did have huge open worlds, it leads to the problem of how to fill it?

We already know there will not be player housing, or cities, so there is really very little point to all that empty space.

I am expecting this game to be pretty linear if i am honest, maybe plenty of trails leading off somewhere with mobs and other irritants along the way to block your path, likely with shear cliffs or mountains either side which you cannot climb or absail down, it will likely all feature on this huge map, of which 80% of it will not even be navigatable.

Thats not to put this on a downer, I just cannot see the maps being all that huge (Navigatable terrain wise) anways

I dunno...

Some reports say that starter worlds took the better part of an hour to traverse when played in demos and may even be larger than that. We have also been told starter worlds are the smallest., That sounds kinda big to me.

I agree with some of the posts that you don't want something so big you can't fill or for things to be navigatable but at the same time in a game like Star Wars I'd think you'd want to create a specific feeling as well.

For instance to me... If I travel to Coruscant a planet that is in it's entirety a city and it's no bigger than say.. Stormwind, or even Freeport in EQ2... then I'm going to be disappointed.
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Lednik

Lednik

Posts : 39
Join date : 2010-11-11

TOR- Your  Expectations? Empty
PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 12, 2010 9:43 am

Havenae wrote:

I'm wondering about this one, myself. I don't know how many of you have actually seen the hero engines at work as far as development goes but, it allows multiple people to build worlds simultaneously and in real time. The engine they are using might not be the prettiest but in terms of development it's simply amazing. It seems like it allows a lot of work to get done in a very short amount of time.

When I watch that and then think about the videos I've seen of the development team talking about TOR and how big it is, after seeing the engine at work I just have to wonder how big exactly are we talking? Will one planet be as big as say as big as all of WoW or a similar game? Will a planet be as big as a continent in most games? I mean I'm very curious because I could easily see TOR being extremely huge. I could see a planet actually feeling like a planet.

I am thinking about this too. If every planet is about the size of entire WoW world or larger, that would be great. I want Universe which can not be explored easily. For example, i was astonished by the size of EVE Online map. Can't imagine how much time is needed to visit and explore every star system there. Months, at least. Personally i think this is exciting, gives me the feeling of a real Galaxy.
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Lednik

Lednik

Posts : 39
Join date : 2010-11-11

TOR- Your  Expectations? Empty
PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 12, 2010 10:00 am

Sylrah wrote:
The thing with the maps is that you want them to be large, but not too large, but definately not too small either.

The larger it is the more immersive it has the potential to be, but too large and it'll feel empty and a chore to travel. It needs size and believable filling. Perhaps have roads from city one to city two, but next to the roads have large explorable areas that may contain secrets.

I'm hoping it'll be about the size of World of Warcraft (or even bigger) for each planet. Although I won't have a problem with it if the planets are smaller and may increase in size as the game gets older.

Indeed a gigantic map can feel empty, but i don't think this is a problem. When you go somewhere in the deep forest (in the real world) probably you will be alone there. And that is how it should be. The areas around quest objectives still will be full of people. If you go questing you will meet a lot of other players doing the same. What i am asking for are large "uncharted" areas where no quest or story sends you to. You decide whether you want to go there or not. If you do probably it will be just waisting of time, but may be deep in that remote forest you will find some hidden treasure or something which no one have found? I am talking about this kind of experience.
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TOR- Your  Expectations? Empty
PostSubject: Re: TOR- Your Expectations?   TOR- Your  Expectations? I_icon_minitime

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