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Grome
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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 01, 2010 11:34 pm

Ty-Odi wrote:
Well, I have an idea for the 'Trade Forum'

And I will be posting more on that later Smile

Basic premise is it would work very much like the trade forums on SWG for anyone who played it and remembers them? I will and I hope others do too, use it to sell items I have come across but do not need to you guys for a far lower price total than say they may fetch on the open market, as i would prefer to help you guys out, than credit cap myself in yet another game, lol. Smile

I just think a nice internal RiG community auction house or something would work really nicely, and allow us to barter for items fairly, and just to help each other out if people need things? could also be used for things like resource contracts, item contracts, and so on Smile
Great! Looking forward to hear your suggestions. New thread INC please! This deserves a full-fledged discussion Smile

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 01, 2010 11:53 pm

A story forum would be handy to keep spoilers from flooding other areas, people will want to talk about the stories, looking at past BioWare games.

Grome wrote:
azarhal wrote:
We need class specifics forums or at least a Republic/Empire split. Having all 8*2 classes * Companions in one spot might be a bit too much, especially for searching specific subject (rule of page #1) and the speed at which people post here already.
We wouldn't need one for every AC. I think one for every class and a general class discussion would be good enough (9 in total). Empire/Republic split might not be enough but maybe I am just overestimating the amount of posts that will come in, so I don't know...

Actually, I wasn't suggesting of having a sub-forum for all ACs. I was simply saying that having one forum for all 8 classes and ACs might be a bit tight. There is 16 classes, not just 8 of them and I'm sure people will post "builds" and which class work best with what type of companions, etc...

Grome wrote:
azarhal wrote:
Maybe having a general Tech Troubleshooting forum as well, with tips/link/etc for people who have problems running TOR. Unless it is a part of the Help Discussion?
That is pretty much what the Help Discussion would be about though we have already agreed it might not be the best name for it... Any suggestions?

See I think that having TOR related troubleshooting help in the "general" sub-section is a bit confusing. But we might not need it that much so, it might not be that problematic.

Grome wrote:
azarhal wrote:
And technically this thread should probably be in the "Forum Help & Feedback" sub-forum.
That is somehow the "Rigger's Forum". So we already have it in place, but the name doesn't help much (suggestions?). It would be for everything RiG-related that is not ingame (Feedback, RL Events, etc)

I mean, this thread, right now, should be in the Forum Help & Feedback forum that exist right now on the forum. Not the OSC one. But it doesn't really matter, more visibility in here.

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 12:08 am

So do we agree that one class forum for each class (9 in total) is the way to go? Or do you think that is too much?

Okay, so let's add this "Story Discussion" forum to our concept then?

azarhal wrote:
See I think that having TOR related troubleshooting help in the "general" sub-section is a bit confusing. But we might not need it that much so, it might not be that problematic.
I see.
I suggest two things regarding this matter:
- Rename it "Aid & Assistance"
- Take it out of the "General" header section and make it an own section (without any subforums for now)
That way this is simply the forum for everything: people having problems with tor, discussion about community aiding in general, other problems, ...

What do you think about Guides? I am torn between putting them in this "Aid & Assistance" forum (maybe with an own "Guides" subforum in it) and putting them in the respective discussion forums (PvE-related guide -> PvE Discussion).
There is also a compromise solution: putting them in the respective discussion forums and then creating a "Guide overview" post in the "Aid & Assistance".
Any thoughts?

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 12:13 am

Something else regarding guides popped into my head:
There clearly is a split up between game guides and out of game guides (such as "how to set up vent" etc).

So here's what I'm thinking now about this:
If you make a TOR guide, put it in the respective discussion forum (PvP, PvE, Class, Crafting, ...).
If you make a general guide (like this vent setup guide), put it in the "Aid & Assistance" forum mentioned before.
Additionally there would be an overview thread for guides in the "Aid & Assistance" that links to all of the guides that have established themselves (both TOR and general).

Sound good?

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 12:13 am

azarhal wrote:
...Maybe having a general Tech Troubleshooting forum as well, with tips/link/etc for people who have problems running TOR. Unless it is a part of the Help Discussion?
I had envisioned this as being part of the Help Discussion Forum. Honestly I don't see this being any more functional for the day to day bugs then the Bioware Official Tech forum, and if we have to track "Long-Term Known Issues and Work-Arounds" enough to make it a separate forum I think this game will be rather unsuccessful...
azarhal wrote:
Will we required a "spoiler" PvE forum for the stories discussion? PvE forum usually talk about game mechanic, but here we also have specific story content for planets and classes. I think it might be a good idea. I do know that BioWare create spoiler and no spoiler forum for their games.
I was thinking Story (aka Lore) discussion would fit into the RP OOC forum. Am I wrong?
azarhal wrote:
And technically this thread should probably be in the "Forum Help & Feedback" sub-forum.
Ty, if you want to move this thread go ahead, I'll update the links here and in the other thread if I see it move.

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 12:22 am

Aldemarran wrote:
azarhal wrote:
Will we required a "spoiler" PvE forum for the stories discussion? PvE forum usually talk about game mechanic, but here we also have specific story content for planets and classes. I think it might be a good idea. I do know that BioWare create spoiler and no spoiler forum for their games.
I was thinking Story (aka Lore) discussion would fit into the RP OOC forum. Am I wrong?
I had thought this would only include discussions about RP itself, how to behave in RP, ideas as to how you make a char, etc.
Then again, those two RP forums would be rather empty compared with the rest.

So here's what I'm thinking:
We make this RP forum (the whole thing) a little broader and transform it into "RP & Lore" (lore was missing anyhow) and make the subforums: 1)RP (IC and OOC together - or we make two, depending on the amount of posts, though I think this will be a little calmer so maybe leave it at one) and 2)SW Lore.
Independently, we put a "Story Discussion" in the Game Discussion Forums header.

That would seem to make the most sense to me at least.

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 12:33 am

I'm putting in a new header type forum, please see the original post:

Aldemarran wrote:
As regards the Welcome, Read Here First! forum; this should contain the Charter, a brief guide to the forum layout, and the "Introduce Yourself!" forum.

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 12:34 am

I don't think Story should be in the RP OOC forum, mostly because their might be people interested in the story, but not into RP. Role-Playing have a specific connotation in a MMO and it's not generally linked to the game story developers have created, but more to personal character stories. In fact, the Story discussion thread will probably be filled with "Did you like this or that NPCs", "For quest X what choice did you pick? or "Did you like this twist for the class X?", etc. It's a place to put all story related matter so the other forums don't get filled with spoilers. The important part is to contains the spoilers, not the story itself for me.

A SW Lore forum is a good idea. I approve of it.

I think that specific guides should go into their specific subject forums too, with stickies and a general sticky in "Aid & Assistance" might be helpful as well.

I think "Aid & Assistance" is a good choice for a forum name and we could put the "troubleshooting" guide in there.

We really don't need 16 classes forums!!!!. Where would somebody put their "Operative vs Sniper" threads anyway? I think 8 would be enough. In fact, each class thread could have a sticky for each AC as a "continuous" discussion, a sticky for the guides and the rest floating for other specific class related discussions.


And we might need a General TOR forum. You know for general discussions, like expansion wishes and next patch info, etc.



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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 12:40 am

azarhal wrote:
We really don't need 16 classes forums!!!!. Where would somebody put their "Operative vs Sniper" threads anyway? I think 8 would be enough. In fact, each class thread could have a sticky for each AC as a "continuous" discussion, a sticky for the guides and the rest floating for other specific class related discussions.


And we might need a General TOR forum. You know for general discussions, like expansion wishes and next patch info, etc.
Actually I was thinking 9 might be better for the classes: One for General Class Discussion (for the likes of "IA vs. Smuggler" etc)

Yes, indeed a General TOR Discussion might be useful in the Game Discussion header.

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 12:47 am

Grome wrote:
...So here's what I'm thinking:
We make this RP forum (the whole thing) a little broader and transform it into "RP & Lore" (lore was missing anyhow) and make the subforums: 1)RP (IC and OOC together - or we make two, depending on the amount of posts, though I think this will be a little calmer so maybe leave it at one) and 2)SW Lore.
Independently, we put a "Story Discussion" in the Game Discussion Forums header.
From what I've seen of RP communities, we definitely don't want to mix IC and OOC content.

/RantOn
I personally always saw Lore as simply the environment in which RP occurs. Of course, in my theory everyone who wouldn't play a game utterly without "story" in their quests they are RPers at least a little bit. "Without Story" would basically be a game on terrain where you had a Widget that toneless told you what to do to complete a task and handed out rewards (XP/Gear/Currency/Etc) and "classes" were called Skill Set #1, Skill Set #2, etc. There would be no "why" or consequences other than your reward, and there would be no "friendly NPCs". RP is Story Telling and Story Telling is RP...

But this could easily start a separate discussion in an entirely different forum.
/RantOff

Does the following sound wrong to you?
  • RP & Lore Forums
    • Lore Discussion
    • RP Help, Planning, & Discussion
    • Story Telling

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 12:49 am

Grome wrote:
...Actually I was thinking 9 might be better for the classes: One for General Class Discussion (for the likes of "IA vs. Smuggler" etc)

Yes, indeed a General TOR Discussion might be useful in the Game Discussion header.
Don't forget that each 'Super Forum" can also hold posts, so I'm thinking you already have 9.

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 12:50 am

Aldemarran wrote:
From what I've seen of RP communities, we definitely don't want to mix IC and OOC content.

/RantOn
I personally always saw Lore as simply the environment in which RP occurs. Of course, in my theory everyone who wouldn't play a game utterly without "story" in their quests they are RPers at least a little bit. "Without Story" would basically be a game on terrain where you had a Widget that toneless told you what to do to complete a task and handed out rewards (XP/Gear/Currency/Etc) and "classes" were called Skill Set #1, Skill Set #2, etc. There would be no "why" or consequences other than your reward, and there would be no "friendly NPCs". RP is Story Telling and Story Telling is RP...

But this could easily start a separate discussion in an entirely different forum.
/RantOff

Does the following sound wrong to you?
  • RP Forum
    • Lore Discussion
    • RP Help, Planning, & Discussion
    • Story Telling
I see your point!
The structure you posted in the end of your post makes sense to me. (Story telling is IC RP, right?)

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 12:52 am

azarhal wrote:
I don't think Story should be in the RP OOC forum, mostly because their might be people interested in the story, but not into RP...

I changed the suggested Title to "RP & Lore Forums", does this accomplish what you want?

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 12:53 am

Grome wrote:
...(Story telling is IC RP, right?)

Exactly, but Azarhal brought up a good point about bias against RP as well.

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 12:54 am

Aldemarran wrote:
azarhal wrote:
I don't think Story should be in the RP OOC forum, mostly because their might be people interested in the story, but not into RP...

I changed the suggested Title to "RP & Lore Forums", does this accomplish what you want?
What Az and I were getting to is, this "Story Discussion" subforum should be one where the people discuss their personal thoughts on the story they experienced while playing TOR (as Az explained earlier). This should indeed still get an own place in the Game Discussion Forums header imo. While still having a separate RP IC forum, as you structured it before.

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 1:00 am

Aldemarran wrote:
Exactly, but Azarhal brought up a good point about bias against RP as well.

As Grome said, the Story Discussion we were talking about is about the Story we find in TOR written by BioWare not "fan made". People will want to share it, ask questions, comment on it, etc. So we need a spot for people to do so.

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 1:18 am

Alright, I am basing this little in-between overview on the updated forum layout from right now.

I just wanna put the ideas out there that were posted before as well but simply got lost a bit due to our fast paced posting Smile


- Suggestion: Rename the "Discussions Forums" header into "Game Discussion Forums"

- Suggestion: Only 9 Class sub-forums (one for each class + general class discussion)

- Suggestion: Pull out Aid & Assistance forum to make a very own header like the Welcome forum - that way it can be a multiple purpose help forum

- Suggestion: Add a Trade Forum as a new header forum (same level as Welcome forum)

- Suggestion: Rename the Rigger's forums into something a little more clear?

- Suggestion: Put a "Story Discussion" sub-forum in the Discussion Forums header for the reasons we clarified in the posts before this one

- Suggestion: Add a "(SW) Lore Discussion" in the RP & Story forum (same level as "Story telling" and "RP Help,...")

- Suggestion: Rename the "RP & Story Forums" header to "RP & Lore Forums" as we added lore to it.



And just quoting this here so I don't forget it myself...
Grome wrote:
Something else regarding guides popped into my head:
There clearly is a split up between game guides and out of game guides (such as "how to set up vent" etc).

So here's what I'm thinking now about this:
If you make a TOR guide, put it in the respective discussion forum (PvP, PvE, Class, Crafting, ...).
If you make a general guide (like this vent setup guide), put it in the "Aid & Assistance" forum mentioned before.
Additionally there would be an overview thread for guides in the "Aid & Assistance" that links to all of the guides that have established themselves (both TOR and general).

Sound good?

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 1:21 am

azarhal wrote:
I think "Aid & Assistance" is a good choice for a forum name and we could put the "troubleshooting" guide in there.
Done.
azarhal wrote:
We really don't need 16 classes forums!!!!. Where would somebody put their "Operative vs Sniper" threads anyway? I think 8 would be enough. In fact, each class thread could have a sticky for each AC as a "continuous" discussion, a sticky for the guides and the rest floating for other specific class related discussions.
...
I've been going back and forth with myself on this as well. My most basic problem is that it is much easier to merge 2 forums than to split 1. Also, pending a LOT of additional information, the needs could change quite a bit. If there turn out to be 8 mirror ACs (same mechanics, different labels and graphics and stories) between the factions, it would probably be best to have some sort of shared structure between the mirror classes. Honestly as we know more I expect to see this structure expand to maybe 3 layers deep. I'm not sure how much to put in at the start.

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 1:24 am

Aldemarran wrote:
I've been going back and forth with myself on this as well. My most basic problem is that it is much easier to merge 2 forums than to split 1. Also, pending a LOT of additional information, the needs could change quite a bit. If there turn out to be 8 mirror ACs (same mechanics, different labels and graphics and stories) between the factions, it would probably be best to have some sort of shared structure between the mirror classes. Honestly as we know more I expect to see this structure expand to maybe 3 layers deep. I'm not sure how much to put in at the start.
Very valid point. It is indeed much much easier to merge two forums than to split them up (in which case you'd have the work of checking every single thread).
I'd agree on leaving it at 16+1 in this case, at least for the time being - until we find out what would suit our needs more.

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 1:38 am

Grome wrote:
until we find out what would suit our needs more.

Magical board that can take care of itself.

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 1:49 am

That'd be nice Smile


btw: Don't know if it has gone unnoticed, the suggestions overview I made just 4 posts back?

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 1:53 am

I have seen the suggestion overview...It's ok in my eyes, a nice summary.

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 1:57 am

azarhal wrote:
I have seen the suggestion overview...It's ok in my eyes, a nice summary.
Now only thing remaining is waiting for feedback from Ald (or other persons if they decide to join the discussion) Smile

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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 2:00 am

Grome wrote:
I just wanna put the ideas out there that were posted before as well but simply got lost a bit due to our fast paced posting Smile
Thanks for the summary, very helpful!!!

Grome wrote:
- Suggestion: Rename the "Discussions Forums" header into "Game Discussion Forums"
Done.
Grome wrote:
- Suggestion: Only 9 Class sub-forums (one for each class + general class discussion)
(For completeness, I'll repeat myself and expand on what I've already said.) Each "Header" is a forum in its own right, so your 9th sub-forum is the header forum. For an example, see the official class forums and note how if you scroll down from the individual class forums breakout there's another full "general class forum" lower down the page.
Grome wrote:
- Suggestion: Pull out Aid & Assistance forum to make a very own header like the Welcome forum - that way it can be a multiple purpose help forum
Done.

Grome wrote:
- Suggestion: Add a Trade Forum as a new header forum (same level as Welcome forum)
Done.

Grome wrote:
- Suggestion: Rename the Rigger's forums into something a little more clear?
Absolutely. Unfortunately I still haven't heard a suggestion that really "clicked" for me Neutral
Grome wrote:
- Suggestion: Put a "Story Discussion" sub-forum in the Discussion Forums header for the reasons we clarified in the posts before this one

- Suggestion: Add a "(SW) Lore Discussion" in the RP & Story forum (same level as "Story telling" and "RP Help,...")
Please clarify, how are these two different? Are either or both of these satisfied by the "TOR Story Discussion" forum under the General Forums header?

Grome wrote:
- Suggestion: Rename the "RP & Story Forums" header to "RP & Lore Forums" as we added lore to it.
I was trying to avoid the double stigma of "Lore Nazi RPers", especially since the Lore Forum got name changed to TOR Story Discussion under the General Discussion header.

Grome wrote:
And just quoting this here so I don't forget it myself...
Grome wrote:
Something else regarding guides popped into my head:
There clearly is a split up between game guides and out of game guides (such as "how to set up vent" etc).

So here's what I'm thinking now about this:
If you make a TOR guide, put it in the respective discussion forum (PvP, PvE, Class, Crafting, ...).
If you make a general guide (like this vent setup guide), put it in the "Aid & Assistance" forum mentioned before.
Additionally there would be an overview thread for guides in the "Aid & Assistance" that links to all of the guides that have established themselves (both TOR and general).

Sound good?
Sounds good. These sorts of things are good to make note of as the next phase of this project is to create stickies for each forum explaining what it is. Shocked

Please note, I'm working in parallel with all of you, and most of the time with myself, so please bear with me here!

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azarhal

azarhal

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Join date : 2010-11-10
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Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 02, 2010 2:09 am

The Story discussion forum should only be about spoilery TOR stories as written by BioWare.

The RP lore & story can be about Star Wars lore and "fan made" stories. Unless somebody think that we don't need a RP Lore & story section.

2 different things.


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PostSubject: Re: Possible Forum Layout?   Possible Forum Layout? - Page 2 I_icon_minitime

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