Hi there! - Respect in Gaming as I understand it

Quince wrote:

Hmm, my view on ganking might be tinted since I tend to play on PVE servers. So, besides battlegrounds, PVP tends to occur when one faction tricks another faction into flagging so that they can gank them. I tend to limit my PVP to FPS games and leave MMOs for other choices. (Yes, I know, this is my personal preference.) Too many times I have been tricked into flagging and by the time my friends show up, the guy who ganked me is now unflagged and untouchable, unless I can trick him into attacking again. I understand the appeal of playing on a PVP server, there's always the potential for retribution.

I know what you mean. Although it was a long time ago, I used to be on a PVE server and I experienced the exact same thing. I'm really not that much of a PVPer, to be honest. I detest the Arena, for example, though mainly because I fail at it.

Quince wrote:

Since you like Full Metal Panic, you'd probably like Eureka 7 (...) To them I might add Witch hunter Robin, Corpse Princess, Darker than Black, or Claymore. I've watched dozens of series, some multiple times. Code Geass, Last Exile, too many to really name. And then there are the movies: Jin Roh and Grave of the Fire Flies come to mind. Both disturbing in their own right.

I saw two episodes of Eureka 7, and for now I'm not sure what to make of it. I know one thing though, the girl with the teal-ish hair and blank stare is making it hard to like it. She seems like such a bland, useless character (and she seems the low IQ type as well). The perfect Japanese housewife type! That just really irritates me.

The art itself is gorgeous though. Clean, crisp, very well animated.

Witch Hunter Robin I've seen some of, but I don't believe I finished it. It was, odd.. Not unpleasant, but not very awesome either. I think that I saw it when it was brand new, and I was disappointed that she wasn't a vampire. Still, it kept me watching until the very last episodes.

Corpse Princess, I have to admit, when I read the description on Wikipedia, I laughed and thought... "AWESOME". I'm definately going to check this one out.

Claymore was alright and fun to watch, even though I didn't see all the episodes. Why the hell were they wearing skimpy outfits, though? You're demon hunters, for spaghetti sake! I suppose sexy babes look better in marketing, eh?

Last Exile, I can barely remember the details, but I most certainly enjoyed watching it a lot. Excellent series! <3

Now that you got my mind thinking on the anime track again, I suddenly remembered Death Note and how absolutely mindboggingly epic that was!

Well, thanks a lot! Now that I'm back on anime again, I have something to take my mind off of the fact that SWToR is still MONTHS away from release...

Cheers!

Basement Cat wrote:

Apologies for side-tracking from the current discussion in this thread, but I finally got around to articulating my reply to the OP.

Respect in Gaming to me has two critical elements.

• All parties are able to disagree without getting offended.
  
• All parties allow each other to play each game in their own way.

Am I right to say that the parties you're referring to are, I'm unsure of the proper term - 'members' of RiG? So, for a realistic example..

• I shouldn't be offended that you disagree with my conjecture that you are a n00b, and in return you won't be offended that I called you a n00b in the first place
  
• I would allow you to drag my raid group down with your 2k dps, while you let me play 24/7, lose my job, become fat and die alone a virgin

Am I doing it right?

Love,
TK

That is exactly right, TK :3

Timekiller wrote:

Claymore was alright and fun to watch, even though I didn't see all the episodes. Why the hell were they wearing skimpy outfits, though? You're demon hunters, for spaghetti sake! I suppose sexy babes look better in marketing, eh?

They wear those outfits because they are cheap to make. Although, some of them get different outfits in the manga. The anime is based on the mange and changed course in the last episode, which is a shame because the manga is still really good and still free of 0 fan services.

You are thinking from only one point of view. The stipulation is that it applies to one and all equally. Borrowing from one of your examples, just because you want to put together a tiger team to go clean house on raids doesn't mean I should disavow you and call you names like "Elitist Jerk". Conversely just because I like to play at 2k DPS doesn't mean you should judge me a n00b or a scrub. Respect would be understanding that you enjoy conquering challenges as set for you by the game and that that is fun for you. Respect would be understanding that I like the way these particularly dis-functional spell combinations create an on-screen visual that I find eternally amusing and that maybe I find perfect performance to be more work than fun.

It almost seems that you feel that somehow respect for a different play-style will necessarily limit your own play-style. Any chance you'd be willing to clarify that point?

Timekiller wrote:

I saw two episodes of Eureka 7, and for now I'm not sure what to make of it. I know one thing though, the girl with the teal-ish hair and blank stare is making it hard to like it. She seems like such a bland, useless character (and she seems the low IQ type as well). The perfect Japanese housewife type! That just really irritates me.

There's a reason she's odd. You find out pretty quickly why she's odd too and it has nothing to do with the demure Japanese woman mythos. Give it a couple of more episodes ... or not, up to you.

It maybe an Ideal but we have been put in touch with like minded people and regardless of what happens here we will take the attitude and desire with us into TOR, its a process that starts small and builds the actions of one dont allways effect many, but they can change one who in turn changes another.

Whether we bring it ona big scale or small scale to me its just important to have that great experience

Welcome

Aldemarran wrote:

You are thinking from only one point of view. The stipulation is that it applies to one and all equally. Borrowing from one of your examples, just because you want to put together a tiger team to go clean house on raids doesn't mean I should disavow you and call you names like "Elitist Jerk". Conversely just because I like to play at 2k DPS doesn't mean you should judge me a n00b or a scrub. Respect would be understanding that you enjoy conquering challenges as set for you by the game and that that is fun for you. Respect would be understanding that I like the way these particularly dis-functional spell combinations create an on-screen visual that I find eternally amusing and that maybe I find perfect performance to be more work than fun.

It almost seems that you feel that somehow respect for a different play-style will necessarily limit your own play-style. Any chance you'd be willing to clarify that point?

It seems that you've mistaken my attempt at humor for something that resembles my feelings on the subject at hand, which it does not. No worries there!

However, I am somewhat glad that you responded the way you did, as it gives me a window to get back on the main point of the OP, which I can further clarify.

Generally speaking, with few exceptions, how others decide they want to spend their time in the game is none of my business. If I have greater experience than they do, I may attempt to share some wisdom with them, but that is all. I won't force the issue. Why would I? Extending a helping hand makes you feel good, making someone play a game in a way that makes them feel uncomfortable doesn't.

Now to the aforementioned exceptions..

This changes in a group situation where some (doesn't have to be all) people are strangers to each other. Whenever I'm a part of a PuG, wether it be a raid or a party, I usually try to be at my best. One of the reasons is, of course, to not give the guild tag under my name a bad rep, but even if I were unguilded, I would still always try to be at my best. The way I see it, the other strangers in the party deserve a helpful, competent and kind party member. They may become dear friends in the future for all I know! We're supposed to work as a team, and depending on the difficulty of the content we're currently clearing, it may be vital to our success.

Assume that one of our party members (a DPS - Player A, for this example) turns out to be the type that likes 'these particularly dis-functional spell combinations create an on-screen visual that I find eternally amusing' and consistently puts out those measly 2k DPS. Upon being pointed out that he needs to step up his game, he responds with "I play the game the way I like it, sorry..." and he gets kicked out.

And here comes the question, who was wrong? The party for kicking Player A, or the Player A for trying to, basically, get a free ride?

I understand that there are still many variables here.. The player could've been willing to recieve some advice, the party could've slowly taken him through the instance, having a few laughs on the way and a pleasant time. The instance itself could've been easy, in which case what would the harm be in having him along?

Understand here, that if it were only myself and Player A in the party, I might not have really minded being with him. This is actually pretty realistic as in SWToR, flashpoints will be able to be done with 2 players and their two companions. But when there's at least one other person in the party, who is doing their job well, when Player A isn't.. And that person demands the removal of Player A, I would kick him in a heartbeat.

If you want to experiment, play with lots of slack, take it easy, and you really feel like being optimal is more like a second job, then I'm afraid you'll have to restrict yourself to friends and guildmates, and forget about joining random public groups. Because with an attitude like Player A, your play-style is effectively limiting the play-style of others. Particularly when the instance is difficult.

Don't misunderstand me here though, I'm pretty sure I know what arguements may be coming in response to what I just said. This does not mean that you should be a master at your class, making sure to read forums like "Elitist Jerks", theorycrafting and always playing at your maximum whenever you're grouped with others. I am not implying that you should get removed when you're doing even 1000 less DPS when everyone else is at 4000. No, I'm not saying that your class spec should be optimal, cookie-cutter.

What I'm asking for is basic competence at whatever you're doing in a public group. Respect your fellow gamers by showing the bare minumum of decent damage/tanking/healing. Do not ever dick around when there are people you don't know! And if the group doesn't feel you're doing well enough, simply leave and find another. They're not there to teach you how to play. That's where your friends and guildmates come in!

So... Is this really what you would call an elitist attitude?

To finish, let me just interject that if say, I'm in a party of newbies that are simply awful at everything, healing / tanking / dps, whereas I'm the only one doing my job.. I don't leave. I stick around. You get to help out a bunch of new players and boost your ego at the same time? Damn, it couldn't be better. Heck, even if they're intentionally 'testing weird and obviously unviable stuff', it's interesting to just see what'll happen.

The sad thing is that whenever you're in a party where everyone is doing poorly, more often than not one person leaves and it starts falling apart. Especially when everyone starts calling each other n00bs.

Well, there you have it. I eagerly await everyone elses thought on the matter!

I believe that what you are trying to get at is the same was what I was trying to get at in a different way.

I believe respect is a two-way street. The performance orient personalities should allow the humor oriented to play their little games, AND the humor oriented personalities should avoid standing in the way of performance oriented objectives. Respect must be mutual.

So I do believe we're pretty much on the same page.

Aldemarran wrote:

I believe that what you are trying to get at is the same was what I was trying to get at in a different way.

I believe respect is a two-way street. The performance orient personalities should allow the humor oriented to play their little games, AND the humor oriented personalities should avoid standing in the way of performance oriented objectives. Respect must be mutual.

So I do believe we're pretty much on the same page.

...

TK has new friend!

Going back to the topic of anime for a moment though, if I'll have the time to watch Eureka 7, I will. As it currently stands, I haven't seen Game of Thrones episode 4, yet and it's Tuesday. Priorities, gentlemen, priorities!

By the way... What's the current situation with http://respectingaming.com ? It looks fully operational, I see brand new posts there, yet I see no announcements here about us moving to new forums or anything like such.

Timekiller wrote:

TK has new friend!

(...)

By the way... What's the current situation with http://respectingaming.com ? It looks fully operational, I see brand new posts there, yet I see no announcements here about us moving to new forums or anything like such.

About that website: Sorry, it's only for the cool guys. :/
Didn't want you to find out that way but we don't really like you...


Anyways... That website is indeed very much operational and we're really just turning a few screws currently (a couple of details still need to be worked on and we're gonna continue working on it anyway). We were looking to make the transition asap (this week, next at most), so feel free to register over there and start posting, it's a pretty cool website/forum

A few have already registered but most of the posting over there has been layout discussions etc so far.

Additionally, we'll soon leave stickies, and announcements or something of that kind in these forums so everyone knows we're moving.

Friends help friends move. True friends help friends move the bodies...

Aldemarran wrote:

Friends help friends move. True friends help friends move the bodies...

You only get to use my truck ONCE!